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Why Most Health Advice is Wrong | John Jaquish PhD

Episode 43, duration 1 hr 34 mins
Episode 43

Why Most Health Advice is Wrong | John Jaquish PhD

John Jaquish, PhD. has spent years researching and developing improved approaches to health. He is the inventor of the most effective bone density building medical technology which is now partnered with Tony Robbins and OsteoStrong for rapid clinic deployment. Inventor of X3, a technology that is proven to develop muscle much faster than conventional weight lifting, all with the lowest risk of joint injury, Dr. Jaquish's methods are used in training the world's most elite athletes and associations such as the entire Miami Heat organization, various NFL and NBA players, as well as Olympians. Dr. Jaquish’s book explaining his non-conventional approach to human physiology is a WSJ best seller.

In this episode we discuss:
– How many repetitions and sets should you do for maximum strength gains.
– Why weightlifting isn’t optimal for health goals.
– Is the carnivore diet the way of the future?
– The problems with conventional wisdom around health and training.
– How to avoid misinformation and bad advice.

00:00:00 Introduction

00:02:26 Challenging the Narrative

00:05:26 What John is Interested in Now

00:07:26 Resistance Training

00:14:11 Weightlifting is A Waste of Time

00:16:11 Learning From My Father

00:19:11 Nutrition

00:21:11 What is Variable Resistance?

00:24:11 X3

00:30:11 Resistance Training and Research

00:39:11 How Long do your Workouts Take?

00:46:11 Nutrition Journey

00:50:00 John’s Diet

00:56:00 Myths that Refuse to Die

00:59:00 Fruit

01:07:00 John’s Mission

01:14:00 Navigating this Harsh Reality

01:18:00 John’s Advice

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John Jaquish, Dr Lyon

Dr. Lyon (01:00:00 -> 01:00:30)

Now I am in studio here with Doctor John Jaquish. I see how you’re looking at me. You’re waiting to see if I’m going to pronounce it, right? And uh lo and behold, this is a Sunday, this is a Sunday. I know days of the week don’t matter. They’re all the same. But I have to say you are special and you are legitimately be, although I was hoping that your better half was going to be here, but we’ll see, we’ll see her at dinner. But you are the only person that I would. Uh Yeah.

John Jaquish (01:00:30 -> 01:00:40)

Hey, I, I flew to New York for you. Like I, I uh yeah, like we just didn’t want to do this over zoom like this way, too many important things we’re going to talk about

Dr. Lyon (01:00:40 -> 01:01:01)

And we’re actually gonna be able to talk about anything that you want. And one of the things I really appreciate about you is you are a thinker and you are very entrepreneurial. Not only that, but you ask a lot of questions and question everything and you challenge, you have no problem challenging the narrative,

John Jaquish (01:01:02 -> 01:02:14)

no problem at all. Well, most narratives are wrong. So we should be asking the question. Why do we do things the way we do? Um, you know, when I was a little kid, I, uh, I don’t know. I was, I had like a huge, uh, they’re probably half pound can of like peanuts and I was watching a movie and I was just too lazy to like, put em away. So I was like pouring them in my mouth, like I was drinking, you know, uh, a drink and I, I had this half pound of peanuts and I felt so awful from that. It made me want to read about peanuts. I’m, I’m talking, I was like, 10. And, uh, so then I start realizing like there’s a lot of things in peanuts that are really not good for people and you’re not supposed to eat a lot of peanuts. And then I also, like, I looked at some different seeds and nuts and beans and, you know, like, I just sort of like, why, why do we eat these things? Like, there’s, there’s like health risks all over the place. Nobody ever told me. My mom never told me. I told her she’s like, oh, jeez, I’ll never buy peanuts again.

Dr. Lyon (01:02:15 -> 01:02:20)

That’s, um, crazy. And you, so, have you always been interested in health and fitness and wellness?

John Jaquish (01:02:22 -> 01:02:23)

I think I’m just interested.

Dr. Lyon (01:02:24 -> 01:02:25)


John Jaquish (01:02:25 -> 01:03:00)

They’re just things that I see, uh, that catch my interest all the time just, I don’t know, engineering problems or, um, I do, like, I do like looking at analyzing the things we do with the human body. Uh, there’s a lot we don’t understand and then what, what we think we understand some of it’s wrong. So figuring out better answers so we can live better lives like, oh, I can’t think of a better way to spend my time.

Dr. Lyon (01:03:00 -> 01:03:23)

Yeah. And you’ve come up with a, quite a few answers. You have also been uh very entrepreneurial in bringing these answers to the public, which I mean, I would say that you’ve pretty much solved osteoporosis and you’re, you’re solving care with affordable care. What, what else are you working on? What is of interest now?

John Jaquish (01:03:23 -> 01:04:51)

Well, I want to get, um, I wanna get everybody much more fit than they’ve ever been or ever even thought they could be. Um, most of fitness doesn’t work very well. Uh I would say 99% of people, this is my estimation, but there’s some research to back this. Uh you know, 75% of, of America is American males are either obese or overweight. Um So, you know, when, when I see, uh you know, it gets the magnitudes where you could probably represent the population. Just the people who comment on my, on my advertisements. Um Most of the people explaining to me how great the gym is. You know, in response to my book, weight lifting is a waste of time. They’re all obese and you know, they, it’s like double chin and baby arms is like the kind of person who comes at me with rage and it’s like, why are you defending an industry that obviously does nothing for you? Like the other day, some guy, like, I’ve been lifting weights for 35 years and I, you know, I’m, I’m in fantastic shape and I just responded to the guy with his own picture and, you know, people, like, just ridicule them, like, are you sure, like you’ve been going to the gym for 35 years? It did, it did the guy just had double chin and baby arms, you know, I mean, like, OK

Dr. Lyon (01:04:51 -> 01:04:53)

how do we get so mixed up?

John Jaquish (01:04:54 -> 01:05:54)

I think people just do what they’re told. Um And, you know, finally we have a government that’s capitalizing on that by seeing how just totally subservient some people are just do it, just do what they’re told and they don’t really question it. Um You know, I’m just kind of blown away. Like humans are um amazing followers, blind followers, not a lot of leaders, they just, you know, not, not a lot of people who are like, well, everybody’s going to the right. I’m just gonna find out what, what’s out there before I make my decision. Um You know, I never took the vaccine like a hurried vaccine. It’s like, hey, I’d rather just get the virus and build natural immunity. Now, I’ve been saying this for a long time. So now what I’m saying is kind of the normal thing to say. But, um

Dr. Lyon (01:05:54 -> 01:06:11)

and that kind of goes to what you’ve been and we’re going to talk all about nutrition too because I, I definitely want to talk about that. How did you figure out? And it’s interesting, I talk a lot about resistance training and I have been listening to you and, and perhaps there’s a component of that we could really improve upon.

John Jaquish (01:06:11 -> 01:11:33)

Oh, well, it’s so I, I don’t, I’ve never really explained this on a big podcast. So, uh, you’re gonna get some interesting content the reason. So, so here, let me, let me go back to the beginning. I went to a high school with this guy named Mark and when we started high school, he was a little bit stockier than me. A little more muscular, maybe two inches shorter than me. And I mean, I, I don’t know, I was just, I’m, you know, almost like 6’1, but I was really skinny like 100lbs Oh, I was a stick. And so we were kind of, you know, the same weight room. Uh, over the, over the summer the guy put on 30lbs of muscle in three months and it was between freshman and sophomore year and, and I did the same thing he was doing and I ate, I ate the same stuff and um, you know, just like, well, what else are you doing? He’s like, I don’t know, smoke cigarettes. I’m like, ok. Well, that’s not, that’s not the magic, you know. Right. Ok. Um, and I watched this guy by, by the time he was a senior he’s benching 575 for repetitions, like, just on his way to the NFL. Um, and so it was like, we did the same stuff, ate the same stuff. It happened for him. It didn’t happen for me at all. I put on a little weight but that was like puberty, you know, it’s like it wasn’t like, yeah, I looked, I had a six pack, I was lean but I just didn’t put on the size. And so I, I remember when I like senior high school, I’m like, I’m gonna figure out the difference. I’m gonna figure out what is different about guys like him because the, basically the people, like in the NFL, the strongest people NFL are strongest athletes in the world, fastest athletes in the world. Our weightlifters love to argue with me on that one. But I’m like, oh yeah, yeah, you, you went into a sport where you make like, like maybe a couple thousand dollars a year, but you didn’t want to go in the NFL because just weight lifting is better, right? OK. Believable. Um So I figured it out and documented. It’s like the last chapter of the book, but in retrospect, I wish I had put it towards the front. My book is, it’s not heavy. It’s, there’s science, but I, I show a study and then I say in this study is important because, and then I’ll explain sort of in layman’s terms. So uh by the time you get to the end of the book, I think people just look at the last chapter and they’re like, oh fuck it. I’m not even reading the last one. So here’s, here’s the difference, a genetic outlier. A person who puts on muscle very easily is not built like me, like because here’s the origin of my pectoral. And if you, I’m not sure if my arms on camera or anything. Uh But I’m just pointing, you know, at my arm, the insertion of the pectoral is usually right here. It’s at the, the top of the humorous bone. So the pectoral pulls the humorous bone towards the midline of the body. But um some people have the insertion on the other end of the bone. Very rare to have that. Um But it means they have a much longer tendon, tendon is the most elastic material on earth. So uh also that long tendon becomes a lever at the same time. So they have an elastic lever inside their body that the rest of us don’t have, which means they are able to move more force and activate the musculature to a much higher degree. So when that person works out. It’s a much more powerful stimulus than when the rest of us work out. When most of us work out. There’s like no stimulus at all. 23%. I think it’s um author starts with a P think it’s probably like the eighth reference in my book. It was a 2008 study. The guy determined that there’s 23% of the population that cannot, with weights ever stimulate any uh uh muscular growth, any any muscle protein synthesis. So they can, maybe they can have some circle plasm growth. They can retain some glycogen in the, in the muscle, make it, you know, a little bit bigger. But that’s not gonna compound that. These are the people who like the first two weeks of lifting, they, you know, put on a couple of pounds of muscle and then they work out for 10 more years and nothing happens no matter what, no matter what. So um yeah, weightlifting just sucks as a stimulus because when I looked at these genetic outliers and I was like, whoa, I can like, I know how to create that effect external of the body. They’re doing it internal but we can do it externally in the, I came to that conclusion when the clinical trials of my medical device were going on in London. Uh So

Dr. Lyon (01:11:33 -> 01:11:34)

what, what was that?

John Jaquish (01:11:35 -> 01:12:51)

That’s osteo, that’s, you know, that’s my bone density device. So we were taking post menopausal females and having them put 800 lbs, 900 pounds through their hip joint. Now. It seems, oh my God, it seems like a lot. But, um, they’re in the impact ready position. So, you know, for my upper body that’s like right here, 100 and 20 degree angle back of the hand in line of the clavicle. So I can either absorb or create the greatest amount of force right here. You know, when a fighter hits somebody, they wanna hit him just like that. They don’t want to hit them here. They don’t want to overextend their arm. They, that’s sort of the, the range they wanna be in when they hit somebody so efficient position versus the inefficient positions. So what I determined in looking at how medical device was working with people, it was designed to just expose these impact ready positions, how you would brace yourself and fall, expose these positions to many multiples of body weight and trigger growth. Um It is two point the minimum dose response in the hip, which is the most important place for bone. Yeah, because fractures in the hip and lives. So

Dr. Lyon (01:12:51 -> 01:12:53)

that kills people very quickly.

John Jaquish (01:12:53 -> 01:13:37)

Yeah, same uh mortality rate as breast cancer. Um It’s just not quite as scary because you break your hip and then you go to the hospital and then you get pneumonia and then you don’t recover. So um putting all these things together, it’s like, ok, we need massive variants. So if you’re seven times, basically, you’re seven times stronger here than you are back here. So, why would we work out with a static weight? And then, so that’s where I came up with the title. Weight lifting is a waste of time for the book and started kind of tinkering with the book and outlining it. Not ever knowing if I was gonna come out with it.

Dr. Lyon (01:13:37 -> 01:13:43)

When did, when did you actually publish it? It was a bit ago, wasn’t it? So, not too long ago, long ago.

John Jaquish (01:13:44 -> 01:13:47)

Sold hundreds of thousands of copies.

Dr. Lyon (01:13:47 -> 01:13:57)

Yeah. Well, um, I am going to read it and we’re gonna share it when your aha moment though, came in high school. Seems as if it, it started.

John Jaquish (01:13:58 -> 01:14:25)

Oh, yeah, it started for sure because it, I mean, I went in a completely different direction. I went in the bone density direction because my mother was diagnosed with osteoporosis. It’s like, well, I’m gonna help my mom and, and you’re an only child, you gotta get the job. I knew no one else was gonna do it. Um, it’s funny my, my dad’s a scientist but he’s um, he never had any interest in the human body. He, he uh, he developed the lunar rover for NASA.

Dr. Lyon (01:14:27 -> 01:14:29)

Yeah. I mean, like, how does he live with himself? Right.

John Jaquish (01:14:29 -> 01:14:30)

I mean, like, yeah.

Dr. Lyon (01:14:30 -> 01:14:34)

Yeah. So you got some good genetic brain genes.

John Jaquish (01:14:35 -> 01:14:46)

I, if, if that can be transferred via genetics. Yes. But it was more just like watching him solve problems, like, never went the conventional way.

Dr. Lyon (01:14:46 -> 01:14:48)

So did he teach you to think outside the box?

John Jaquish (01:14:48 -> 01:15:46)

Yeah. Yeah. It’s completely and, uh, now it’s like he laughs now because I’m talking about all kinds of stuff he doesn’t understand isn’t particularly interested in. I mean, like, I, I, I see him, you know, reading, like, popular mechanics and it’s like all the advancements in automotive technology. He’s just excited about it. And then sometimes I’m like, hey, check out this study, you know, on statins and he’s like, can you just tell me what it says? He doesn’t, yeah, he doesn’t really care that much. But uh yeah, anyway, that’s kind of cool. Um So it was just different interests but over this whole period of time, I finally come to that conclusion, like we’re so much stronger in the impact, ready range and we are so disadvantaged in the weaker range. Um Unless you have that, that genetic anomaly situation where you have the longer tendons in the body.

Dr. Lyon (01:15:47 -> 01:16:01)

And what percentage of people do you think even have so less than 1%? Doesn’t that make all this? I mean, that would probably confuse all the studies that we’re looking at for muscle protein synthesis if we’re not even taking into account the,

John Jaquish (01:16:01 -> 01:16:05)

but who ends up in those studies, the people who are really into weightlifting? Yeah.

Dr. Lyon (01:16:06 -> 01:16:08)

And self selected is what you’re saying.

John Jaquish (01:16:08 -> 01:16:43)

Yeah. So that it becomes self selecting and uh like, for example, one of the most powerful references for variable resistance exercise. So in the more recent years, there have been some studies done with banding um and bars and, and stuff like that. And there was one where they did it on, uh they had a control group that lifted regular weights and then they had the uh the variable resistance group, but both groups were Cornell athletes. So it’s like, ok, I mean,

Dr. Lyon (01:16:44 -> 01:16:45)

self selected to be.

John Jaquish (01:16:46 -> 01:17:03)

Yeah. So the people who lifted weights grew muscle and the people who used variable resistance tripled the gains of the weightlifting group. So it still came out much better. But they’re all genetic outliers.

Dr. Lyon (01:17:03 -> 01:17:03)


John Jaquish (01:17:03 -> 01:18:13)

Yeah. And so it’s like, oh, ok. Like, it’s a, it’s a bummer but the people who generally end up not liking weightlifting or getting results from weightlifting, they go, they, they leave it, they go do something else. I mean, it doesn’t mean they’re not going to be athletic. They might do something that doesn’t require a lot of strength. Uh, you know, I mean, whatever, some other hobby. But, um, I think you need to focus on muscle. The two greatest drivers of long life that are uncontested are high levels of muscularity and low levels of body fat. And that, I mean, that’s what got brought me to my nutrition conclusions because nutrition research is all over the place. You can find anything is great for you. Uh, especially when the study is sponsored by Nabisco. Um, or, you know, the other way around if they’re actually doing their jobs. So, um, I had to back that one up too and go, ok. What’s gonna make people live the longest, high level muscularity, low level body fat? Well, there’s only one way you’re gonna eat.

Dr. Lyon (01:18:14 -> 01:18:15)

For sure. in my opinion

John Jaquish (01:18:18 -> 01:18:33)

In, in, in, in the, uh, in the outcomes of pretty much every unbiased study out there. Yeah. Um, so, you know, heavy animal protein. Um, so now getting, getting to the point I, I’ll go back to the,

Dr. Lyon (01:18:33 -> 01:18:52)

everyone, everyone wants to know. So, should they be lifting weights? It seems like that that’s not super efficient. Uh, there’s other ways to do it that you’re talking about that. I mean, you’re the only person that I know that’s even talking about it in this way. Is that true or is it gaining more? No? Yeah. The only one.

John Jaquish (01:18:52 -> 01:18:57)

I see my job is pretty important because, uh, I don’t,

Dr. Lyon (01:18:58 -> 01:18:59)

and it’s variable resistance is

John Jaquish (01:18:59 -> 01:19:02)

that, that’s, that’s the scientific term

Dr. Lyon (01:19:04 -> 01:19:13)

So, in another 17 years, perhaps we’ll have more people that will continue to be working on this. And what is variable resistance?

John Jaquish (01:19:13 -> 01:20:28)

It’s just changing the resistance as we move. So, when I, when I do like a bench press movement I’m holding 100lbshere, about 300lbs in the middle and 5 50 at the top. And, um, that triggers an incredible amount of growth. Uh I get a much bigger level of exhaustion. Um Only need to do one set per exercise in fact, the fact that we do when lifting weights, the fact that humans do more than one set is so symbolic of how absolutely lame weight lifting is because it’s like, how many sets do you need to do in the sunlight to get a tan? You know, and people look at me when I ask that question, I’m like one, right? How many, how many sets do you need to do in the garden to build a callus? Let’s say you’re not talking to a weightlifter. Well, you know, one hard abrasion on the hand, that’ll build a callus. Right? So why do you do five sets in the gym? It’s because the stimulus sucks, barely does anything. And then on top of that, when you’re in the weaker range of motion, you’re typically overloading the joint and damaging it.

Dr. Lyon (01:20:28 -> 01:20:31)

Is that why people get injured as they get older?

John Jaquish (01:20:32 -> 01:20:56)

They, they get injured when they’re younger and they ignore it. And that, and that’s why it becomes chronic. Like talk to anybody who’s been heavy bench pressing for 10 years and, you know, they gotta wipe the tears off their face after they put their shirt on because they just, you know, that range of motion is brutal, the pain in their shoulders. I have no pain in my shoulders

Dr. Lyon (01:20:57 -> 01:21:05)

and for people that are either listening or watching you’re very fit and buff, individual people can. It’s true. This is just fact. Yeah. Yeah,

John Jaquish (01:21:05 -> 01:21:09)

I’m about 7% body fat. I’m 200 I’m about 230lbs

Dr. Lyon (01:21:10 -> 01:21:13)

And how long have you been as lean and as fit as you are?

John Jaquish (01:21:14 -> 01:21:18)

Um, that’s a great question. Uh, only recently.

Dr. Lyon (01:21:20 -> 01:21:20)

Is that true?

John Jaquish (01:21:20 -> 01:21:28)

If you, if you look at me, like before I turned 40 like I was just an average guy a little overweight.

Dr. Lyon (01:21:28 -> 01:21:29)

Is that true?

John Jaquish (01:21:30 -> 01:21:31)

Like 19% body fat

Dr. Lyon (01:21:32 -> 01:21:33)

What changed? What changed for you?

John Jaquish (01:21:34 -> 01:21:37)

Just inventing X three. So how old,

Dr. Lyon (01:21:39 -> 01:21:43)

how old is X three in my mind? This has been around forever.

John Jaquish (01:21:44 -> 01:22:19)

no, no Uh God, like, well, I launched it when I was 42 uh because I, I want to really get the results first before going and saying everyone’s going to get the results because, but it’s funny because in the beginning, I was like filming some of the training videos and the comments were like, why is this like fat weak looking guy, like promoting this product. And then other people were like, I like that. They chose a model because uh especially early days like I like that they chose a model.

Dr. Lyon (01:22:19 -> 01:22:21)

Be sure to link one of those videos. Oh

John Jaquish (01:22:21 -> 01:22:36)

It’s so funny. Like, they would actually like applaud us for picking like a chubby guy to represent the product and it’s like realize you’re trying to compliment me. I’m not really taking it that way, but

Dr. Lyon (01:22:36 -> 01:22:47)

how long did it take you to, uh come up with it? Understanding that, that the burial bo resistance was the key and the way in which he, I mean, how long did it take? How many years?

John Jaquish (01:22:49 -> 01:23:04)

It’s funny. It takes years, like, it really takes years of thinking and collecting information. Basically, you don’t want to come out with something and have everyone go like, you’re a fool like this, right? I mean, that,

Dr. Lyon (01:23:04 -> 01:23:05)

that’s not a great,

John Jaquish (01:23:05 -> 01:23:07)

no, it’s not a great strategy. A

Dr. Lyon (01:23:08 -> 01:23:09)

strategy really

John Jaquish (01:23:09 -> 01:24:03)

had to, like, convince myself that it’s as great as I think it is. And um, so like first year put on 30lbs of muscle, I had never put on, you know, uh more than maybe a pound of muscle. And, you know, like I told you, like, all my weight lifting, 20 years of weightlifting, I pretty much just kept telling myself I was putting on size, but I was just getting fat, you know, like, you know, a lot of like the, they have this, they have this thing now. Uh they say I’m a power lifter. It’s like, no, you’re just obese and you have a gym membership, you’re not a power lifter. Um You know, like that, I, I was kind of in that mindset. I was like, all right. Well, you know, maybe I’m just a little heavier looking and I, I wasn’t really coming to grips with the idea that I was just getting fatter.

Dr. Lyon (01:24:03 -> 01:24:06)

Do you think it was? Because everybody told you you should be lifting weights?

John Jaquish (01:24:07 -> 01:25:44)

Oh, why did I keep doing it when I didn’t do anything well, because I knew I didn’t want to be weak. Yeah. I just didn’t want to give up on it because I thought strength was a great thing to have. It just didn’t seem to work too well for me. So, it was like, every time I went into the gym for 20 years I just, like, wow, like, this is such a waste of time. I need to figure out how to make it. Not a waste of time. Uh, and, you know, of course, I, I look around and I would ask people, uh, another thing from, from high school I saw, I saw these guys, like, you know, uh, there’s a really nice gym. I went to, I went to high school in the Napa Valley. Yeah. Um, and so it’s really nice, there was a really nice gym and I would, I would have a membership there, uh, uh, every summer and I’d see the same guys every year. They’d be, I don’t know, they were in probably their twenties and thirties and, and they’d all talk to each other about like their latest strategy and it was, you know, they, they would definitely bear the mark of the last truck that hit them because I and I, most stupid people do because, and these guys weren’t particularly stupid. They were just, you know, some Flex magazine would have like a new thing you gotta do. And, oh my God, like this is how the Islanders put on muscle and of course nobody, there is an Islander but they’re like, wow, this is our new program and, you know, they’re just running around in circles all excited about their program, like a dog in heat. And I’m just like, it’s a waste of time again.

Dr. Lyon (01:25:45 -> 01:26:26)

Do you think that this changes, what we think about the potential for putting on muscle? Because often times people will think, well, I can only put on, I mean, there’s a couple of schools of thought that an untrained person could potentially put on 2lbs of muscle a month. I have very rarely ever seen that. And we look at bone, I mean, we look at Dexa scans, we look at all kinds of things and the literature will say one thing, but in clinical practice it’s totally different. The amount of muscle and the potential that somebody has. I, what I’m hearing you say is that maybe they’re never living up to that because they’re not stimulating the tissue in the most effective way.

John Jaquish (01:26:26 -> 01:27:00)

I mean they’re trying to get a tan with candles is what they’re doing. That’s what weight lifting is. It’s just the wrong tool. I mean, it’ll probably always continue to be a sport but it should be seen as a sport where the human body has to deal with the inefficiency of a static weight. Um, and it, it, it’s almost like power lifting is really the only school of thought that understands that the human body is just totally not built for picking up heavy objects.

Dr. Lyon (01:27:01 -> 01:27:04)

And that goes against what everybody is thinking because we would think that the body is

John Jaquish (01:27:04 -> 01:28:58)

designed lifters. I don’t think they’d ever word it the way I’m wording it. But they understand, like, when they study, you know, the, the mechanics of just like a dead lift, they know how just we are not designed to really do that well, but they’re gonna do it anyway because they can make certain muscles stronger, certain tendons and ligaments stronger, uh, and, and overcome those inefficiencies by just being efficient. You know, you’ll see a power lifter move very quickly through some of the range of, you know, parts of range of motion. They can use momentum. They can, they can do a whole bunch of different things because they’re aware of the inefficiencies. Whereas, and I mean, an actual power lifter is like 0.1 of like percent of people who train, train with weights, rest of the people are just pounding their head on the wall. You have no idea what they’re doing, just doing what the guy next to him is doing. Uh, uh, you know, just, just as stupid as like, I should wear a mask because my neighbors are all wearing masks. You know, it’s just like, ok, you’re a lemming. Good job. You’re, it’s like a low life form. Uh, but it, it’s, I just keep trying to hammer in, in people’s heads. Like, just because you’ve heard it your whole life doesn’t mean it means anything. Uh, you know, Frederick Gobel said, you tell a lie 1000 times it becomes the truth. This guy was the propaganda minister for Adolf Hitler. I mean, like you can just manipulate people really well, just tell them the same stupid thing over and over and over again. They’ll just believe it.

Dr. Lyon (01:28:59 -> 01:29:11)

Where do you think, um, variable resistance training is gonna fit in with some of the, the research because a lot of the, the research is hypertrophy strength, this continuum of lifting

John Jaquish (01:29:12 -> 01:29:29)

right now, there’s 16 really high quality studies. Uh They all show variable resistance will grow muscle and develop strength way faster. Like the one study I was referencing, which wasn’t really set up, well, still had triple the gains with

Dr. Lyon (01:29:29 -> 01:29:31)

the. Yeah.

John Jaquish (01:29:31 -> 01:31:15)

And I, I never liked that. I actually, I’ve, I’ve gone to a different sort of strap line of the product which is greater force, greater gains. So, I mean, that’s a universal truth. Uh, but we truly are exposing the body to much more force than we ever would in the gym. And that’s what triggers so much growth. But we’re playing to the efficiency of positions and de loading the inefficient positions while still taking them to fatigue. So, a set with X three is, you know, I’m gonna go to that 5 50 the 300 the 1 50 I’m gonna go through that whole process until I can’t get to the 5 50. Then I’m just gonna do shorter reps with 300 and then I can’t get there anymore. Then my last couple reps might only be an inch with 100 and 50. But now I have taken all ranges of motion, the entire muscle to absolute fatigue. You cannot ever do that with a weight, not even close. So, um, you know, it’s, it’s, um, after I got started, I saw Doctor Atia um on, uh, on someone else’s podcast and he said, um, yeah, I don’t, I don’t encourage weight lifting very much because I feel like weight lifting, overloads, joints and under loads muscle. And I was like, wow, like this guy is actually thinking the same, same way I am. Uh And so that was like a huge point where I was like, ok, now the world’s ready for this. Like people didn’t throw, you know, uh, uh, tomatoes at him when he said that it was in front of a live audience too, which I thought was kind of a cool show where,

Dr. Lyon (01:31:15 -> 01:31:19)

did you have any failures on the way to developing the X three bar?

John Jaquish (01:31:21 -> 01:31:26)

Not X three No, the, the bone density medical device. Yeah.

Dr. Lyon (01:31:26 -> 01:31:27)

What’s that?

John Jaquish (01:31:28 -> 01:32:44)

Yeah, I mean, I like, yeah, there were, there were plenty of strange directions that we took and just had a scrap it and go with another, another, another design. Now, it’s pretty perfect right now. The, the bone density, uh osteo strong, uh, there’s always room for improvement of anything and that’s a problem. Never, you know, if you, you never really wanna ask an engineer that question because it’s like you’re always in redesign. In fact, uh here’s something my dad told me never work for an engineer because if an engineer is running the company, all they wanna do is redesign the product. They don’t really care about sales or marketing or anything. All their head is always like, ok, well, the next version, you know, and also uh he told me if you ever work at a big company, don’t let the salespeople talk to the engineers because the engineers will convince the sales people that the product we’re selling right now sucks. We got a better one come and then the sales people are gonna want to talk about what’s next meaning they’ll never sell anything. So, uh yeah, I, I thought those, those pieces of advice were pretty funny.

Dr. Lyon (01:32:44 -> 01:32:48)

So you are not going to be redesigning the current product.

John Jaquish (01:32:49 -> 01:33:44)

Well, it’s funny you say it uh last week as a matter of fact, as a matter of fact, no, last week, last week, it really launched the flagship product. Uh It’ll be, it’s at a higher price point, it’s about $1000. Um But it’s a bar that synchronizes to your phone. So you get to see the real time force. So through that range of motion, very cool, even more powerful, it captures, it captures a metric, we’re calling total force, which is if you look at repetitions, uh you know, like cross section repetitions like a sine wave, you know, up the rep, down, up, down, we total all the force created under the sine wave and that’s total work. So if you like, so I may have uh you know, chest press day where I have, you know, I’ve done 9000lbs of total work

Dr. Lyon (01:33:44 -> 01:33:48)

How long do your workouts take you? Uh

John Jaquish (01:33:48 -> 01:35:12)

Let me get back to that, that, that’ll be the next thing I go. So if you, you capture all that weight under the sine wave, well, you could be almost there because you’re competing with your previous. So now, you know, OK, you know, I’m going to fatigue but I’ll try and get an extra couple of shorter reps, you know, but just a couple to get to the point where I have put more force through the muscle this time than I did last time. So it almost guarantees the perfect stimulus every time. Yeah. Yeah, that is, that is so cool. Like you just, you, you look at the numbers, you know, it and, and it’s funny, like, I only have one for myself, you know, cobbler’s kids has no shoes. So, uh, you know, like, um, regular x-rays. I got one in the trunk of my Lamborghini. I got, you know, one in that lives in my suitcase. I got one in my place. I got, you know, so I got plenty of those. But the new one, I just have one and I leave it at my office. So that’s my, like during the week, you know, when I’m in town, that’s, that’s the one I use just because I don’t want to like, lose it or damage it or anything like that. But, you know, at some point I’ll, I’ll be traveling with that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And um, it’s almost to the point where I’d rather skip a workout than not have the digital feedback because it just guarantees that the muscle is stimulated.

Dr. Lyon (01:35:12 -> 01:35:15)

Wow, And do you track it on yourself in terms of muscle mass growth?

John Jaquish (01:35:16 -> 01:36:53)

Um Yes and no, because diet has a lot to do with that. I’ve been trying to get leaner more recently. Um I think I’m, I think it shows much better being leaner that I’m not a performance enhancing drug user because as soon as I get lean, people are like, oh yeah, he doesn’t look like a bodybuilder. And uh and I don’t, I mean, body builders, body builders are somehow lean yet their face is bloated like a balloon. Um, I mean, just, you know, like tomato heads, all of them and, uh, you know, it’s because of blood pressures through the roof and, uh, you know, all kinds of awful things that are happening inside their body shows, but it also kind of gives them a healthy look whereas when you get a little too lean and you’re a natural athlete, you kind of look little skeletal. Yeah. And, uh, so, you know, there’s a balance there but it, it like, I, I get way less uh you know, accusations of steroids comments, the leaner I am because they just kind of look at me and they’re like, yeah, that’s not, that’s not a, not a pe D abuser’s face. So I, you can just kind of see it on me. So, so I’ve been trying to do that, which means a lot of days of calorie deficit via fasting. So, um yeah, I can, I’m not gonna put on muscle at the same rate as if I get the protein and, you know,

Dr. Lyon (01:36:55 -> 01:37:09)

surplus. Well, I definitely want to talk about nutrition but I know that everyone wants to know how long are you working out a day? And if you’re doing cardio and then, and then I want to hear all about your nutrition because uh I think you and I have very uh somewhat similar views

John Jaquish (01:37:09 -> 01:38:06)

we do for sure. So, um my workout when I started was 10 minutes and it’s, you know, says it all over the X three website. You can get a workout done in 10 minutes. Yeah. Uh When you become really muscular, you can’t get it done in 10 minutes because you have more of a, a draw of blood. Like there’s more demand. Like when I train my biceps, you know, like I, I go to contract my bicep, it’s that big around, you know, like I’m, I need a lot of blood to go there and I am like gasping for air after a set. Uh And so the larger the muscle is the more of a cardiac demand, it is I need to catch my breath. I need, I need to go back to a kind of a resting heart rate uh before the next set. So, you know, that that can take a couple of minutes between exercises. So I’m still doing four sets per workout,

Dr. Lyon (01:38:06 -> 01:38:11)

four sets of how many reps?

John Jaquish (01:38:11 -> 01:38:33)

no, four exercises I shouldn’t say set. You only do one set of each. So it’s just 4 different exercise. So, you know, one is like chest press, overhead press, um tricep, press and then calves pushing it, you know, and then we do a poll the other day with uh

Dr. Lyon (01:38:33 -> 01:38:39)

you’ve now piqued the interest of all the men listening to this podcast because they’ll probably be able to grow their calves.

John Jaquish (01:38:40 -> 01:39:07)

Interesting. I used to post about how no one can really grow their calves. Calves. You gotta be born with great cats. It’s completely not true. My legs used to look like, like paper towel tubes, like just nothing and now it looks like somebody, you know, like stitched a rib eye steak on the outside of my leg. Uh, and then just painted over it

Dr. Lyon (01:39:07 -> 01:39:11)

So, another myth that we think is true. That is true. And

John Jaquish (01:39:11 -> 01:39:25)

my calves are awesome. Like sometimes, I mean, you can see them right through my pants. Um yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, yeah, I defeated that myth. Um, now you also asked do I do any cardio? Absolutely not.

Dr. Lyon (01:39:26 -> 01:39:32)

Is it because the, it takes time your heart rate is going up when you’re doing the variable resistance and you need recovery or just,

John Jaquish (01:39:32 -> 01:42:01)

no, it’s, uh, only because of the cortisol, the chronic cortisol issue. Um, nothing wrong with cortisol. Your body doesn’t produce any bad hormones because I always hear like fitness people like that’s the bad hormone like, idiot. Like there’s no such thing as a bad hormone. You don’t want it chronically elevated though. Um, you know, you don’t want growing and leptin chronically elevated. Uh, either so and they’re wonderful hormones. So it’s like, ok, um, cortisol goes up when your body is stressed, getting out of bed in the morning, cortisol goes up but then it goes back down, have a cup of coffee goes up, but then it goes back down. Um, when you do cardio more than 20 minutes, uh, usually above or at target heart rate. So, still aerobic, um, you will up regulate it for two or three days, maybe. Well, if you’re then trying to become an endurance athlete, you do that over and over again. Now it’s chronically elevated. So let’s look at what cortisol does. It gets rid of muscle and preserves body fat. So you stay as fat as possible as long as possible. Now, a lot of people have gotten to the point, you know, when they, when they get into it, they’re not necessarily overweight, but it’s a skinny fat situation where you’re cannibalizing the muscle and then you’re, you’re preserving body fat. So, like, you’ll never be lean or strong. And, like I, you know, mentioned with my nutrition decisions being lean and being strong, the drivers of long life. So, you know, basically cardio athletes are gonna quit doing all that cardio when they turn. I don’t know, maybe 60 or something like that. They have joint problems all over the place and they’re gonna die younger and they do statistically. Uh, and, oh God, like runners will, they’re like vegans, they will come up with bullshit research. Like, and twist a study. Like they’ll have an interpretation. You read the study. It’s like, it’s not what the study is even about. Yeah, I mean, just, just completely, like, distorted reality and, yeah, it’s a, it’s a bummer because I do admire, uh, somebody who can run a marathon. Like, that’s cool. It’s just not good for you

Dr. Lyon (01:42:01 -> 01:42:25)

I agree. My husband’s actually training for the Boston marathon. Not by choice. Uh He’s doing it because some, I don’t know, he’ll have to tell us, but it’s supporting some troops in some way. And he’s like, God, this is a terrible idea. I mean, he’s not a, he, he’s not a born runner to say the least

John Jaquish (01:42:27 -> 01:42:27)

nobody’s a born runner

Dr. Lyon (01:42:27 -> 01:42:31)

born runner. What about high intensity interval training or any kind of sprint interval?

John Jaquish (01:42:31 -> 01:42:55)

Love that Oh, yeah. Uh If I had the time I would do that. Um I used to be really fast. Uh I was an outside center um in, in rugby, uh in university, so really enjoyed that. Uh I’d love to play rugby again but, you know, I’m 46 years old. So like also my wife would just be terrified

Dr. Lyon (01:42:55 -> 01:42:58)

Rightly so, rightly so.

John Jaquish (01:42:59 -> 01:43:13)

I used to race Lamborghinis and as soon as it got to the point where I had done enough training where, you know, I was doing wheel to wheel races, you know, where you’re passing people and yeah, she’s like, no,

Dr. Lyon (01:43:14 -> 01:43:16)

I like, I like her already.

John Jaquish (01:43:17 -> 01:43:37)

Well, it’s funny like when I truly saw that look of fear, you know, and she starts blinking really fast, like she’s gonna cry and she’s trying to hide it. She’s trying to be like, supportive and concerned but not really show her emotions because I mean, I don’t know why she would ever think I would be mad about that

Dr. Lyon (01:43:38 -> 01:43:50)

because we all, we want to support our husbands in their really bad ideas and we don’t want it to be, you know, um, I have to choose but it’s, I’m glad that you saw through that

John Jaquish (01:43:51 -> 01:44:05)

Well, and she’s like, but, you know, like, what about me? What if you get hurt? I was like, ok, I don’t need to do this. Now. I am gonna be racing classic cars, but that’s very different. Everybody does one lap and it’s whoever has the fastest time.

Dr. Lyon (01:44:06 -> 01:44:08)

Ok. I mean, it’s relatively safe?

John Jaquish (01:44:08 -> 01:44:13)

relatively safe and, well, because you think, like, you really don’t want to destroy a classic car.

Dr. Lyon (01:44:14 -> 01:44:15)

Yeah, I can imagine.

John Jaquish (01:44:16 -> 01:44:20)

right, and so the cars are treated with a lot more respect by

Dr. Lyon (01:44:20 -> 01:44:21)

the 65 miles an hour and

John Jaquish (01:44:21 -> 01:44:40)

not all, you know, things are, it’s, it’s more like the, the celebration of some of these amazing cars that are from our past that are really special. So, um, I’m having a, a G T 40 a 1969 G T. Yeah. Yeah. Completely rebuilt from, from the rails.

Dr. Lyon (01:44:40 -> 01:44:41)

That is so cool.

John Jaquish (01:44:41 -> 01:44:41)

Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Lyon (01:44:41 -> 01:44:58)

Yeah, I, I want to hear about your, your wandering through nutrition. You’ve probably started eating one way, have transitioned and I’m curious as to what your thoughts are and, and the current space of nutrition where you see, we really fail, how we’re even thinking about it.

John Jaquish (01:44:59 -> 01:45:51)

Yeah, this is, this is the hardest thing for me to talk about because I got a lot of answers and, um, it’s also not my field. So I kind of had to discover this. Uh, well, after finishing my phd in, I mean, I think I was just generally, like, I was thrilled as soon, but then as soon as I started telling people about it, they saw it as very limiting and like, removing stuff from your diet that’s bad for you is not limiting. You shouldn’t ever look at it that way. Like, if I tell you, pizza sucks, you shouldn’t really eat it. You know, maybe if you’re not from New York and you happen to be in New York and you like New York pizza? Ok. You know, have a slice. Um, I did last night. I had a slice of pizza.

Dr. Lyon (01:45:52 -> 01:45:52)

Did your wife have one too?

John Jaquish (01:45:53 -> 01:45:55)

Yes, she did. She never had New York pizza

Dr. Lyon (01:45:56 -> 01:45:57)

Was it worth it? Was it good?

John Jaquish (01:45:58 -> 01:46:00)

Not really It’s not that special

Dr. Lyon (01:46:00 -> 01:46:00)


John Jaquish (01:46:01 -> 01:46:55)

No. Chicago is just, is, is not that special either. It’s just deep, you know, just more carbohydrate. It’s like, ok, you know, so now it’s like I did that like, you know, the next time we’re here. Oh, you want to get a piece of pizza? No, we already did that. Um, but so telling people that really the culprit in nutrition, just broad stroke is just carbohydrates. Like past glycogen replenishment, which your body can do on its own by the way, you know, gluconeogenesis pass that it might be advantageous to have 15 g of carbohydrate before a workout. Um, and, yeah, I have a supplement that’s uh a combination of essential amino acids and glucose. Um, you’ve been very busy, I’ve been very busy.

Dr. Lyon (01:46:55 -> 01:46:56)

Very busy making lots of stuff.

John Jaquish (01:46:57 -> 01:48:04)

Yeah. And so that’s the, it’s for a specific protocol, um, really to try and trigger hyperplasia. So we get a little bit of carbohydrate. You get a lot of hydration in the essential amino acids. All. Once you work out, you stretch. And um this has been proven a couple of times in research. Um the strength training plus the stretching plus what’s volumizing the cell. Uh it stretches out the facia of the muscle and uh it allows for cell splitting, uh muscle cell splitting. And so, you know, previously, you know, 20 years ago, it was like, OK, the only place hyperplasia happens is in the womb. But you know, we know better. Now it’s been, it’s been proven we can actually induce this. And so uh that, that’s, you know, my supplement and I actually get 100 and 50 g of protein out of just that personality. I mean, I ingest the essential amino acids and they become 150 grams

Dr. Lyon (01:48:05 -> 01:48:12)

and notice you said essential. So you’re um you’re eating so not the, the full spectrum of amino acids, just the essentials okay?

John Jaquish (01:48:13 -> 01:48:42)

No, your body makes the rest, right? Yeah. You, you really only and that’s, that’s where I help vegans because like, you know, really not in favor of that. I think it’s gonna go down in history like anorexia and bulimia. Uh but it’s just based on bad information. So I do tell vegans, like, look, if you want to eat the way you want to eat, like I’m not gonna argue with you, but you should, you should take in, in that uh essential amino acid complex is made out of fermentation. So, you know, no animals are involved.

Dr. Lyon (01:48:43 -> 01:48:56)

That’s cool. Now, tell me about your diet. Tell me, I mean, we were kind of talking before about the uh push of uh triglyceride L D L. It sounds like you’ve been thinking a lot about your nutrition as of late.

John Jaquish (01:48:56 -> 01:49:37)

So I had a fresh perspective. I, I was like, OK, I launched X three. I wanna have a nutrition, you know, some nutrition programming to make people successful because the only people who didn’t succeed with X three uh in the beginning were the ones who, you know, I’d asked how many grams of protein and they, oh, I get a lot like 30 g a day and I’m like, just put a zero behind that number like you. And this was a particularly large guy who said this uh because you want to write about one gram per pound of body weight. It’s actually there’s been a, a new meta analysis that was done on performance and gaining muscle. Um, they found a little bit less

Dr. Lyon (01:49:39 -> 01:49:44)

but then again, where are you gonna get your calories from? It’s either gonna be carbohydrates or, or fat. Yeah.

John Jaquish (01:49:45 -> 01:50:05)

Or you can just be perpetually in a deficit and just get your protein and not really worry about anything else. Uh, which tends to be kind of my current style, especially because I’m getting 150 from four to, um, 150g of protein. And then, you know, I have a pound and a half of steak and you know, they

Dr. Lyon (01:50:05 -> 01:50:06)

call it a day.

John Jaquish (01:50:07 -> 01:50:50)

So I eat one meal a day. It’s just meat, meat and water. That’s it. Um, pretty simple. It’s not limiting. People are like, don’t you get tired of eating like that? I mean, there’s a nice way to answer that and then there’s the way I do answer it, which is like, you ever just, you know, brush your teeth with a toilet brush? And they’re like, no. Right. Like, but you don’t feel the need for variety. Like, aren’t you just bored of your toothbrush? Why don’t you try the toilet brush? And they’re just like no, the toothbrush is the right tool. Right? And there’s one thing we should be eating. Now, I like a sunny side up egg sometimes.

Dr. Lyon (01:50:50 -> 01:50:53)

we eat all the time

John Jaquish (01:50:53 -> 01:51:38)

we eat that all the time Yeah. Um, cheese, I got a couple little issues with some cheeses. Um, just has to do with some of the proteins that are more prevalent in cheese. Like, um, they can have a inflammatory mucus response for some people. Yeah, for some people. And, and so I just, you know, people are, like, can I eat cheese? Like, can I eat tons of cheese? Like, I don’t know about tons. You can eat it. Yeah, it’s fine. So, uh, yeah, I eat the, pretty much, the only thing that we eat that is just all nutrients and carries no damage at all is me is meat is animal protein. So,

Dr. Lyon (01:51:39 -> 01:51:52)

you know, some people would argue with you and say that that is the bane of the existence and probably causing heart disease and, and, and colon cancer. Wait, wait, what? So that, that’s a good one.

John Jaquish (01:51:53 -> 01:51:59)

So, the, the major study that was like, you know, the watershed moment for colorectal cancer.

Dr. Lyon (01:52:00 -> 01:52:00)

The nitrate

John Jaquish (01:52:02 -> 01:52:30)

nitrate me. Ok. So they found a couple of groups of people that for 40 years, you know, how were they? One of the groups they picked was people who ate meat every single day for 40 years, they ate nitrate meat every single day. And for those of you who don’t know what nitrate meat is. This is like a gas station hot dog, like Oscar Meyer doesn’t do this anymore.

Dr. Lyon (01:52:30 -> 01:52:31)

And what else were they doing?

John Jaquish (01:52:32 -> 01:52:55)

Right. And it’s like if you’re eating a gas station hot dog every day, uh, you’re probably smoking cigarettes, you’re probably doing all kinds of stuff that doesn’t put your health as, you know, a priority. I mean, like intravenous drug use. I don’t, you know, I don’t know. But lots of awful shit and, uh, you know, they don’t control for those variables

Dr. Lyon (01:52:55 -> 01:53:00)

and it’s, and it’s also a low, a low quality state, uh, study. It’s epidemiology. Right.

John Jaquish (01:53:01 -> 01:53:49)

It’s surveys and a lot of people fill out surveys the way they’d like to believe they live, not the way they live. Right? So, and, and at times I’ve seen researchers do this, you know, when they conduct an interview or they write the re the questions, like some studies will actually show the questions and the questions are like so leading and they’re not supposed to do that, but peer reviewers don’t call them out on it. I do, I do peer review for um uh archives of physical medicine. Um and they’ll uh they’ll have things, you know, like, like that. But uh I read those and I’ll say like, wow, like you shouldn’t really include the data from this one particular question because it’s a leading question

Dr. Lyon (01:53:50 -> 01:53:55)

Do you think that there are certain myths that just refuse to die? Kind of like the red meat colon cancer?

John Jaquish (01:53:57 -> 01:54:19)

People wanna believe Like we have news in this country that’s biased, well, all in one direction except for Fox and then they’re in the other direction. Um People love their biased news. It’s a shame. People really like, it’s, it seems like they don’t want the truth, they want to hear what they’re most comfortable with.

Dr. Lyon (01:54:21 -> 01:54:26)

and it’s unusual though, right in, in the nutrition space as well. It’s unusual. I know,

John Jaquish (01:54:27 -> 01:54:55)

like, why, I mean, I guess people would rather die younger so they can eat Twinkies and feel good about it. I, I don’t get it, like, I’d rather just have the real answer and then if I have a friend that’s like, you know what? I like Twinkies more than life and I’d be like, knock yourself out, dude. Like, you know, I, I don’t, I don’t assume you’re gonna show up to that workout day. You know. It’s just like, ok, that’s what you wanna do.

Dr. Lyon (01:54:56 -> 01:55:02)

Do you think that there is a handful of myths, maybe just off the top of your head that just refuse to die? I mean, I see it all the time

John Jaquish (01:55:02 -> 01:55:26)

If it’s what somebody wants to believe, um, you know, vegans, Nabisco pays for a lot of research that supports veganism, it’s not because it is because they know vegans don’t eat kale exclusively. They eat cookies and cakes and all kinds of vegan products and they make billions off. Yeah.

Dr. Lyon (01:55:27 -> 01:55:40)

And so, and it’s a huge, and so that you have all these groups fighting amongst themselves. It’s a complete smokescreen. I mean, the whole animal, the animals are the main source of greenhouse gas cows. It’s, it’s all a smoke screen

John Jaquish (01:55:41 -> 01:55:57)

Oh, well, I, so I don’t really know. Maybe you can help get this message out if you take a blade of grass and it falls over like no cow ever ate. It, it starts to decompose, it creates the same amount of methane, like

Dr. Lyon (01:55:58 -> 01:55:58)

marginal land

John Jaquish (01:56:00 -> 01:56:33)

the plant is always going to convert to methane, whether you eat it or not. And like I, I posted that and some guys like, well, yeah, but the same blade of grass will come up and then the cow will eat it and like it’s just like, what, what difference does it make? Like? Ok, or it’ll die or the grass will just keep on growing taller and then more methane will be created like all plants give off methane when they go through their life cycle period. And the cows, the cow, whether the cows there or not, it makes no difference.

Dr. Lyon (01:56:33 -> 01:56:49)

Yeah, what you’re saying um I believe is true that these companies like Nabisco Drive, they drive funding and also they drive our conversation and they, they drive what we think is healthy and then they divide us and you have individuals

John Jaquish (01:56:49 -> 01:56:51)

that they, they turn into an emotional argument

Dr. Lyon (01:56:52 -> 01:56:53)

and you can’t win those.

John Jaquish (01:56:54 -> 01:57:32)

Well, yeah, you can, the moment somebody becomes emotional, there’s no argument at all. You’re just talking to a child and I, I’ll tell people like you made it emotional, which means you’re just a child when it comes to the subject. So you know, fuck off and that’s what the banned buttons for no one wants to hear from. You lose your ass again. So, uh yeah, I mean, that’s, that’s how they have to be treated. Uh There’s a reason that social media platforms have the banned button because they know a lot of people are just there to cause trouble. And

Dr. Lyon (01:57:32 -> 01:57:39)

uh what about this whole seed oil situation and, and fruit? And I’m just curious as to what your thoughts are because I’m sure you’ve thought a lot about this.

John Jaquish (01:57:40 -> 01:58:09)

Yeah. You knew, I want to talk about the fruit thing. So a guy I really like, started promoting, eating fruit along with your carnivore diet. Uh, and I told him it’s not a good idea. Uh, and, and the reason it’s not a good idea is because high L D L s higher cholesterol is gonna happen to anybody who eats meat exclusively. It actually doesn’t go as high as you’d think. Do you think

Dr. Lyon (01:58:09 -> 01:58:15)

it’s for everybody or do you think it’s a saturated fat issue or total calories with a higher L D L,

John Jaquish (01:58:16 -> 02:01:54)

um, how the body decides to process, like, you know, I can eat five eggs and you can eat five eggs and we get our blood work done, you know, a few minutes later and, um, your body will actually deal with it a little differently. And so it, it, it’s, it’s not, we don’t fully understand like how one person will deal with it and there are some people who just by default, have higher cholesterol
. Now, the good news is we have learned that higher cholesterol is actually makes you live longer. So the whole premise behind statins was wrong. interestingly enough statins have been applied in some other ways that actually have been relatively positive. Um, but not for that. And you know, when somebody says, well, I have high cholesterol, I’m like, wow, you really need to read something like anything like in the last 10 years on cholesterol because you don’t understand. And um so, but the issue is when you have high LDLs and then let’s say, so you’re eating mostly meat and then you want to go and eat a bunch of fruit too. Uh This is what this friend of mine was doing. Uh He starts advocating fruit and that is. So now you have high triglycerides and right and high L D L. So you basically have an artery that’s sticky because that’s what triglycerides do. They, uh the walls of the artery become particles become more easily trapped. And when you have a lot of free floating particles, like low density lipo protein, it can get stuck and cause a blockage. Like it’s this L D L uh triglyceride thing. The eating a lot of fruit with your meat only diet. It’s a recipe for a stroke. And uh so I, I kind of stayed silent about it for like a year and you know, talking to other uh other medical professionals about it, cardiologist about it. It’s hard to find a cardiologist that understands carnivore nutrition unless you have a couple of hours to sit down with them. Uh But you know, a whole bunch read my book and they were like, this is awesome. I know the whole L D L thing is bullshit. Um Like, we don’t need to worry about cholesterol. Like I love your book and then I’d be like, hey, can, can I run something by you? Because I, I wanted to talk to over 100. Just that number was in my head. Like I, I wanna talk to 100 people about this who really know what the hell is going on because I wanna make sure I’m right. Uh If we could just eat all the fruit we want and all the meat we want and OK, whatever. Um It’s not the case like we just shouldn’t need it. Now if you want to eat a lot of fruit and you’re not really eating protein anyway because you’re eating kale and oh you gotta get your greens. I hate it when people say that like they know something. Uh It’s like, OK, fine. You’re not gonna be lean and you’re not gonna be strong, but it’s not gonna kill you either. This actually will kill you. So, oh that’s a shame. But

Dr. Lyon (02:01:55 -> 02:02:00)

so do you think there is fruit? I mean, so again, you’re saying that there could be fruit in the diet but it really has to be

John Jaquish (02:02:02 -> 02:02:48)

very limited. Yeah. Like, I’ve never been, like, zero carbohydrate. As far as my recommendations. I have been personally, uh, you go many days without having any carbohydrates at all. But, um, yeah, there’s just, there’s just no upside and, uh, and there’s a big downside and, like, like the, this, this fruit thing I am, I’m afraid what’s gonna happen is some people are gonna have strokes and they’re gonna blame the meat instead of it’s like, well, this, you know, a person had a very extreme. Somebody had somebody, they just, somebody died recently and they called his diet extreme and it was, you know, carnivore and he died of something completely unrelated to, like his nutrition

Dr. Lyon (02:02:48 -> 02:03:07)

and we know that higher amounts of carbohydrates will drive trigly rights up. Yeah. I mean, there’s no way that, that’s one of the first things that we do. And, you know, my mentor, Dr Donald Layman, he did some of these early studies where he reduced individuals, um, total carbohydrate intake and he saw a drop, 40% drop in triglycerides.

John Jaquish (02:03:09 -> 02:03:17)

Yeah. I mean, there’s, there’s no way around it. Like, if you have carbohydrates in your diet, you’re going to have hydro glycerides,

Dr. Lyon (02:03:18 -> 02:03:19)

uh, depending on how many

John Jaquish (02:03:19 -> 02:03:31)

carbohydrates. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So, like if, if somebody wants to have, like, I stay under 50 g, like, like, even, you know, we’re going to sushi tonight.

Dr. Lyon (02:03:31 -> 02:03:34)

They better be, it’s gonna be cooked sushi. Yeah. Yeah.

John Jaquish (02:03:35 -> 02:03:41)

Yeah, there will be some, um, actually, uh, restaurant my wife, uh, chose has a really good rib eye.

Dr. Lyon (02:03:42 -> 02:03:51)

I don’t know. I might be having that even though, and by the way, your wife is so thoughtful we going to early dinner. That was really thoughtful. And I heard that that was

John Jaquish (02:03:51 -> 02:03:56)

like, it’s like nobody wants to go out late when they have little kids because they want to be home and put the kids. So

Dr. Lyon (02:03:57 -> 02:04:21)

they are, they are cute and also a good form of birth control. But um you were saying that you can, I mean, you do well on 50 g or less. Uh you know, I actually do well in a little bit higher but I, I could do lower but, you know, I do pretty well on moderate carbohydrate diet. I’m, I’m very small human. My reist red looks, you know, they all, all my markers look great.

John Jaquish (02:04:21 -> 02:04:26)

What are your carb choices usually? Is it slow digest?

Dr. Lyon (02:04:26 -> 02:04:26)

Oh yeah, yeah. yeah

John Jaquish (02:04:29 -> 02:04:45)

Um Yeah, I, I did come to a con conclusion which forced me to create uh another product uh called cytronium. This product takes it changes the glycaemic index of the, you know, the carbohydrate

Dr. Lyon (02:04:45 -> 02:04:48)

Does it have some kind of white bean extract or something?

John Jaquish (02:04:48 -> 02:05:13)

Citrus peel. Yeah. Um In citrus peels, there’s a lot of really powerful acids that um can alter. So like somebody could eat a Snickers Bar and it digests with the same glycemic index of a carrot. So, I don’t want people to do those sorts of things, but they will, I mean, I’m dealing with, like, I have a million followers now. I know. How are you?

Dr. Lyon (02:05:13 -> 02:05:20)

So, what you mean your mission is to really change the face of the way people take care of themselves. What is your, I mean, I’m assuming that’s your mission.

John Jaquish (02:05:21 -> 02:05:26)

Oh, yeah, my mission is to lead people to live just healthier happier lives

Dr. Lyon (02:05:26 -> 02:05:47)

I mean, because if you think about it, if you take a step back, you have pretty much probably met nearly every goal you’ve set for yourself. Plenty of money, beautiful wife, great career. So you, you’re not doing it because you have to at this point and if you don’t have to, there’s always something else that drives the person.

John Jaquish (02:05:47 -> 02:06:06)

Sure. Well, this is fun. Like I think talking about this, making new discoveries, getting people excited about what I’m excited about. Like, that’s fun. Like I don’t, I don’t like I, in my mind in some way, I, I don’t know, I quit working when I was like 30

Dr. Lyon (02:06:07 -> 02:06:12)

but you’re still driving really hard and creating new things.

John Jaquish (02:06:13 -> 02:06:16)

I, I don’t ever expect it to be any different.

Dr. Lyon (02:06:17 -> 02:06:28)

Um, do you have any major failures aside from, you know, that thing with the osteo device? But is there anything else or do you just move on so quick.

John Jaquish (02:06:29 -> 02:07:39)

So you wanna engineer small failures, so you avoid big failures. Like I, I come up with an idea. Um you know, let’s say, like cyntronium up with that idea and I ran it by, you know, um Well, first person I go to is Henry Alkire, he’s my co-author uh co-author of the book and one of the smartest people I’ve ever met in my life. He’s awesome. And I, you know, I said like, OK, I think there’s a marketing message here that’s powerful. I think it’ll be helping a lot of people out because they’re just unwilling to go like super low carbohydrate. So if we can just kind of reel back the damage that carbohydrates do. Oh, I, I, uh I described it that way and I had so many people damage, like you’re such an idiot for saying carbohydrates do damage. I’m like, have you ever heard of diabetes? You think that’s a good thing?

Dr. Lyon (02:07:40 -> 02:07:43)

And you’re, you’re very unscathed by the social media world.

John Jaquish (02:07:45 -> 02:07:46)

What do you mean?

Dr. Lyon (02:07:46 -> 02:07:48)

I mean, you see like you don’t care.

John Jaquish (02:07:48 -> 02:09:41)

Oh, uh It’s a matter of perspective if I see my job or somebody asked me, I was on this kind of weightlifting sort of podcast. And the guy is like, so what do you describe as your job? And I said, I’m a shepherd. If I tell myself that it feels like that’s kind of what I’m doing. I’m just, you know, trying to get the herd to go in the right direction and, you know, there’s always the dumb ones that just won’t see it. Uh, but, you know, it’s ok because it’s not for everybody. Um, you know, I, I, I, I struggle with, I, I’d say my biggest challenge right now is really connecting with more people who are at all places from a socioeconomic standpoint, telling people they have to eat meat. That’s expensive. I mean, our government is against eating meat and I know why and it’s not a sinister reason. It’s because they know at some point, uh, menial labor is gonna disappear because it’s gonna be replaced by robotics. Now, the people in the bottom third of intelligence quotient will have no job. They will be dependents of the government, you know, wards of the state almost. Um, and you can’t give them another job. Like these are people who Jordan Peterson defines as they, they cannot do anything other than a floor. They can’t, like, if you give them a vehicle, they’ll crash it. If you give them a gun, they’ll shoot themselves in the foot. Um, they’re just dumb and, uh, like, and this is like, you know, the most outspoken people on the internet also because, uh, I mean, you know, the Dunn & Krueger study right?

Dr. Lyon (02:09:41 -> 02:09:45)

I do, unfortunately

John Jaquish (02:09:45 -> 02:09:49)

true, like the most unintelligent people, they don’t know what they don’t know

Dr. Lyon (02:09:50 -> 02:09:57)

And unfortunately some of them are influencers and they just can’t even engage them because in the

John Jaquish (02:09:57 -> 02:11:52)

fitness industry that’s almost everyone. They don’t, they don’t know what they don’t know. And because they’re unaware that they don’t know some stuff they think they know everything. Yeah. And, uh, I mean, they’re kind of dangerous but also it’s pretty easy to point out that they’re wrong. So, I do. And, you know, again, I’m a shepherd. That’s, that’s my job. Like I got to point out who’s just a fool. Oh, also I never attack people. I only criticize an idea like I’ve never said like so and so has it wrong? Like you notice, I didn’t even mention the name of the person. Yeah, because I like him. He’s awesome. I just think he got the one thing wrong. Um Yeah, and I, I never um you know, we’re, we’re fighting because we’re living in a world of bad information. Um We’re living in a world where sometimes bad information is profitable for someone. Um You know, Nabisco and Kellogg’s will never tell us the truth. They’re gonna tell us to eat more breakfast cereal. Yeah. They even got the federal government to say frosted mini wheats are the most nutritious thing you could eat on earth. A product that comes in like a plastic bag in a box that’s the most healthy food according to Tufts University and the White House. Um Yeah, it’s, it’s uh I’m going to have to be the guy that breaks it to everybody, you know, there’s a percentage of people who are just gonna be on government assistance and yeah, they’re probably gonna eat crummy food. But if that’s not, you pay no attention to what they’re doing. It’s just a sad reality

Dr. Lyon (02:11:53 -> 02:12:09)

How do you think people can navigate? What recommendations do you have? I mean, obviously finding people you trust and listening to them, but even they can get things wrong. How, how do you suggest people navigate this land? Mine this field of, of so much information,

John Jaquish (02:12:11 -> 02:12:30)

they have to decide who they want to believe. Like when, when my fans listen to me, uh they typically don’t have trouble swallowing anything. I’m saying. Also you notice like all of my posts on social media have peer reviewed references.

Dr. Lyon (02:12:30 -> 02:12:33)

they’re excellent, all of them

John Jaquish (02:12:33 -> 02:13:32)

of them like, maybe if I don’t make a scientific statement, I won’t, you know, put a reference there. But um everything about the human body, we should know where that, that information is coming from. So it’s sort of like you’re not really doing what I’m suggesting you’re doing. What about 1000 different studies are suggesting and these studies were done by people who are the top of the field, who we’re trying to get to the truth. So, like, you know, obviously none of the, none of the biased uh study, there’s, there’s no biased study from the from the meat industry. There is a meat industry but um the margins in meat are typically uh single digit percentages, you know, like some, somebody who’s got a, you know, a huge cattle production business, they might make 6% whereas a box of Triscuits 600 percent

Dr. Lyon (02:13:33 -> 02:14:02)

And also what you’re saying is, let’s say the, the beef industry, all commodities have to allot, they all have money that they allot towards research, whether it’s dairy, egg beef, it’s the beef check off, you know, and again, the marketing budget, the research budget, you know, these big companies, it’s not what, $9 billion if it’s Nabisco or someone else and it’s a couple, a couple million dollars together.

John Jaquish (02:14:03 -> 02:14:34)

It’s uh well, and you can also, when you’re Nabisco and they did this uh multiple times they start some nonprofit, you know, research that they fund exclusively and, you know, it’s like the, the research institute for health and nutrition and then that becomes, that’s Nabisco by proxy, but most people don’t know it, you know, and then, you know, like I, I’ll never trust anything at a Tufts University again, like they’re corrupt. They just took money to lie

Dr. Lyon (02:14:34 -> 02:14:51)

And there’s also some of the other bigger institutions that all do that as well. A lot of the Ivy League institutions that put out a lot of information that are funded by a lot of these Kellogg type um companies really, really make it challenging.

John Jaquish (02:14:51 -> 02:15:40)

Yeah, so to navigate, you really just have to learn, like you, you gotta see both messages and then make, make a determination on your own. But the people that I argue with whether it’s, you know, from an X three perspective, if X three works, if variable resistance training works, um, or nutrition, it’s only the ignorant that have the problem. Like, there’s never been a single day where like somebody who actually knew the subject was like, hey, Jaquish, you’re wrong about that. Never happened. Uh So not that I’ll get everything right. I mean, we all get something wrong. Um, and I’m not guaranteeing I’m always gonna get everything right.

Dr. Lyon (02:15:40 -> 02:15:44)

But you’re pretty, you’re pretty diligent. You’re pretty, you’re pretty diligent. You have

John Jaquish (02:15:44 -> 02:16:08)

to be giving somebody the wrong health advice could kill him. Right. So, I mean, and that’s like why I felt the need to speak up about the fruit thing, you know, I mean, ok, and like people are doing it and, and again, it does, it’s not a death sentence for everyone who’s doing that, but it just increases the chances. Why would you want to increase your chances of a stroke?

Dr. Lyon (02:16:09 -> 02:16:33)

You wouldn’t? Yeah. And nobody wants that. You know, I am curious. You’ve done a lot of amazing things and hopefully one day you’ll be a father, um, which is amazing and you have a lot of young people listening and watching you. Is there a piece of advice that you would give them coming up? Now? You probably have a lot of really good advice.

John Jaquish (02:16:34 -> 02:16:47)

Yeah, I have a lot of really good advice that nobody would take. You know, it’s the problem. I worked so hard on getting my company off the ground. I went for seven years and didn’t pay myself anything

Dr. Lyon (02:16:48 -> 02:16:54)

Did you doubt yourself that you could get it off the ground? Never. Have you always had this much conviction?

John Jaquish (02:16:55 -> 02:18:46)

Yes. Uh, you have to because when you’re gonna do something that no one’s ever done before, you’re gonna be surrounded by people that are telling you you’re wrong. Um I mean, and that’s probably why I just seem kind of un bothered when it comes to people being upset uh on the internet because like, I, no one questions me, like I question myself and that’s not doubt. That’s me not being in a place where my idea has matured enough in my own head. So that I’m gonna be like, I’m, I’m either not gonna present it and try and prove my theory wrong. So I come, you know, I come up with a theory and it’s like, how would I prove this to be false? And then I do all the work I can to try and really demonstrate that my idea was wrong. And uh you know, there’s some ideas that I’ve had that it a couple of different movements, a little, some biomechanics ideas I had uh that never saw the light of day, you know, I test them and, you know, it’s not gonna work. Um So like I’ve, I’ve tried to, I try to sort of change how people would, uh, train quads because it’s so there’s such a cardiovascular demand because, you know, it’s biggest that in your glutes, like when you do squats, like that’s why you’re just, like, beat when you take your legs to fatigue. And I tried a little different, a couple of different variations and no squatting is still the best.

Dr. Lyon (02:18:46 -> 02:18:50)

So nobody questions you like, you question yourself.

John Jaquish (02:18:50 -> 02:18:53)

Nobody, nobody could come even close.

Dr. Lyon (02:18:53 -> 02:19:02)

You know, I think that that’s what makes excellence and I mean, you’re pretty humble and, but this is an example of excellence, right? You

John Jaquish (02:19:03 -> 02:21:39)

Yeah, also, I mean, remember like the, the people that are full of themselves, it’s a front like is there if you have to walk around like, like you’re great. It’s like no, like those guys are just full of shit because when you really did something and you helped a bunch of people, it, it’s not, that’s not how that come, you know, it’s like, that’s not what comes to mind. It’s like I’m satisfied with what I do and it’s fun. But man, like I don’t, I don’t need to pat myself on the back. Uh When, when people, you know, like when people call me a genius, I’ll be like, you know, I don’t know about that. Einstein was a genius. I’ll settle for clever if you wanna call me clever. I’m, I’m fine and also everyone has to keep in mind that all of these things, all of them or wouldn’t exist if it wasn’t for the research. So there’s like thousands of other people that worked on this that worked on these ideas. I mean, it was many, many, many, many layers ago, but like, I, I want to give credit to them. Like they, they can, they challenge convention too. And uh so I, I appreciate all those researchers out there that are doing, you know, the right research and, and, and coming out with something that doesn’t fit the narrative, you know, like you and I just to be funny, I mean, this would take a lot of time. So we probably won’t do this. We could basically come up with a, a study that says like, veganism is great and meat sucks and causes cancer and like, we could write the shittiest study and probably get it in a good journal. Like, and, and I mean, we, we, we would do this just to prove like you can say, like any stupid thing as long as it fits in with, you know, what’s cool to say, medical journals, don’t, they’ll be like, oh excellent, go to work and it’s like, no, like we just faked it. Um You know, and there’s, there’s other ways uh researchers can, can do that sort of thing. But when, when you show up with a paper that’s like, hey, the whole industry has been wrong about this. Like, those are the ones they don’t really want to publish or if they do, they will scrutinize the hell out of it. And uh so, so even the medical community suffers group think they,

Dr. Lyon (02:21:39 -> 02:22:03)

they absolutely do. I mean, and they’re trained to be very algorithmic. Um But, you know, you have to determine who’s on the editorial board was the individual who produced a particular paper. And there’s been many, especially within that um lower protein group that have actually sat on the board of these journals, like sell and push these papers through.

John Jaquish (02:22:04 -> 02:22:49)

How about seventh the Adventists? If you’re Seventh the Adventist, it is your mission given to you by God to get people to stop eating meat. And these people are on boards that determine nutrition. Why? I mean, I think again, Seventh Venice, every one of them I ever met was a really nice person, but they didn’t seem so nice after I told them I only eat meat. We were like, oh, oh, you know, like just horrified, they look like Elmo on fire. You know, you’ve seen that like, it’s just like just, oh my God. And uh yeah, sorry. But you know, that’s, that’s what the body needs to be at its best.

Dr. Lyon (02:22:50 -> 02:23:58)

You know, you probably don’t remember this, but this was probably a few years ago and I shot in again, you get probably thousands of D MS and I asked your advice on something and I don’t know if you remember this. But, and you know what you said to me, because I was very inspired by what you’ve really taken is from bench to bedside. And when I say bench to bedside is you’ve looked at the research you’ve helped with it and then you’ve brought it to it, you’ve made it actionable. And I was not a, it was so, and I was so inspired by your charisma and how you did it. And it was, it was just amazing to see. And I asked your advice because I have a mission. I believe that we’ve been focused on obesity and we’ve completely missed the mark. And we’ve spent decades focusing on pathology and symptomology of, of impaired muscle. And, you know, for me, I, I want to get that out there and I asked you, do you have any advice? And do you remember what you said? I mean, how could you remember? I’m going to share and what you said it was cool. It was be really good at what you do, in fact, be the best at what you do.

John Jaquish (02:23:59 -> 02:23:59)

I still give that advice.

Dr. Lyon (02:23:59 -> 02:24:02)

it was just really good advice. So, thank you. You’re

John Jaquish (02:24:02 -> 02:26:48)

welcome. Well, I, I, I, when I get asked for advice, a lot of gas stations because like, I pull up in the Lamborghini and you know, like half the people just give me a really dirty look and usually like, it’s teenage boys will come over and they’ll be like, dude, what do you do for a living and, uh, tell, tell them a little bit about it. Wow. Yeah, it’s so cool. Like, what advice do you have? And, uh, you know, I kind of try and size them up, like, ok, like, how much of the matrix should I show this guy? Because it’s like, I can’t, you know, tell them, like, you sound like a crazy person when you say like, everyone who’s giving you nutrition and exercise advice is lying or just stupid and wrong or they’re just following along with everybody else. So um and I try, I try not to do things like that. I’ll say like you need to question what you’ve been told. Like if, if you like a certain thing we do and it’s, you know, like, let’s say you like racing cars. Um And uh you get into the design of how these cars are put together, never let anybody tell you, oh, we can’t do that. I wrong. There’s almost every way we do things in automotive engineering in the past. It was like, that’ll never work and that just happens all the time, but you never hear about how something was revolutionized unless it’s at the time it was revolutionized. Uh So even though we are a very creative country, we don’t really encourage creativity, we encourage following, encouraged doing it the way it, it was done. And, and my phd advisor told me, I, I developed the bone density device first and then I went and got my people and he said I was almost graduated and he said, I waited a while to tell you this. But if I’m gonna tell you now, he said, if you had got your phd first and then had this idea, you would have talked yourself out of it because the problem with structured education, which I’m against, uh I mean, sometimes you need a credential but you know, if you’re a lawyer, you gotta go to law school and pass the bar. Um but they teach you how things are done and you can’t do them any other way. Um It’s just so often wrong.

Dr. Lyon (02:26:49 -> 02:27:15)

Yeah, that’s, that’s really good advice. Doctor John Jaquish. Thank you so much for spending Sunday afternoon with me. This is great. I’m sure we will have you back on and uh thank you again and I’ll put all the links of where people can find you and all your stuff. And I, and I would like to play with an X three bar myself and, and, and all the other. So thank you so much.